CSV import issues

amtvsn

New Member
Hi,

I'm trying to get my MoneyBook for iPhone synchronised with iCash on my Mac and I've experienced some issues with importing. I use russian version, so I'm not sure if I give you the right names of fields, so I'll give you the russian translation aswell.

Here are my settings.
- I'm using "Bank statement" import (in Russian: –í—ã–ø–∏—Å–∫–∞ –ø–æ —Å—á–µ—Ç—É)
- Bank account (–ë–∞–Ω–∫–æ–≤—Å–∫–∏–π —Å—á–µ—Ç): Cash
- Default account (–ù–∞ —Å—á–µ—Ç –ø–æ —É–º–æ–ª—á–∞–Ω–∏—é): Other expenses (–ü—Ä–æ—á–∏–µ —Ä–∞—Å—Ö–æ–¥—ã)
- Delimiter (–†–∞–∑–¥–µ–ª–∏—Ç–µ–ª—å): Semi (–¢–æ—á–∫–∞ —Å –∑–∞–ø—è—Ç–æ–π)
- Encoding (–ö–æ–¥–∏—Ä–æ–≤–∫–∞): None (–ù–µ—Ç)

I tried to change the original file to make it more clear for iCash, but with that kind of time expenses, import feature becomes useless. I attached both original and adjusted files to the post.

Fields I have in my CSV:
- Date
- Type
- Category (Account)
- Amount
- Note (Comment)

Issue No. 1. As you can see I have no "Source account" field. So I set the Bank account in settings to "Cash", but it is ignored. Instead of using "Bank acocunt" as Source, it uses "Default acocunt" from Settings.

Issue No. 2. There is no option to connect different names of categories (accounts). E.g. I have "Shopping" category in MoneyBook and I use it fro Grocery in iCash. How am I supposed to deal with this?

Issue No. 3. Type of transaction in CSV is Expenses (notice the ending "s"), and the title of the same type in iCash is Expense. I could run a search-replace in Excel which I would like to avoid of course, but after that, it is still ignored. So Income (–î–æ—Ö–æ–¥) is reconised correctly, and Expense (–†–∞—Å—Ö–æ–¥) is still igonred.

Issue No.4. Rules don't work. I could imagine, that I correct the names of categories with rules. But they are completely ignored. I think this is language issue. In the meanwhile all titles including the comments are pisplayed properly in the preview window. Notice that most of comments are empty, because I don't feel like I should spend precious seconds after paying a couple of € to type in the comment, which will probably repeat the name of the category.

Issue No. 5. If dates in CSV are in format 01.09.10 and not in format 01.09.2010, dates get moved somehow. That way I got dates after 28.09.10 moved to 1st, 2d and so on in October. Why don't you just make format setting like DD.MM.YY like text input?

Thanks
 

stanbusk

Administrator
Staff member
Issue No. 1. As you can see I have no "Source account" field. So I set the Bank account in settings to "Cash", but it is ignored. Instead of using "Bank acocunt" as Source, it uses "Default acocunt" from Settings.
Do you mean the preview doesn't use the account you have selected?
Issue No. 2. There is no option to connect different names of categories (accounts). E.g. I have "Shopping" category in MoneyBook and I use it fro Grocery in iCash. How am I supposed to deal with this?
Not sure I understand what you mean. In iCash what most software call categories are folders. iCash uses accounts for everything. An account belongs to a category and each category belongs to a type.
Issue No. 3. Type of transaction in CSV is Expenses (notice the ending "s"), and the title of the same type in iCash is Expense. I could run a search-replace in Excel which I would like to avoid of course, but after that, it is still ignored. So Income (–î–æ—Ö–æ–¥) is reconised correctly, and Expense (–†–∞—Å—Ö–æ–¥) is still igonred.
Incomes and Expenses are the names of types. Those names should never be used! In an importation you use account names not type names.
Issue No.4. Rules don't work. I could imagine, that I correct the names of categories with rules. But they are completely ignored. I think this is language issue. In the meanwhile all titles including the comments are pisplayed properly in the preview window. Notice that most of comments are empty, because I don't feel like I should spend precious seconds after paying a couple of € to type in the comment, which will probably repeat the name of the category.
The Import from a bank statement is comment based, with no comments the function is useless and will never work.
Issue No. 5. If dates in CSV are in format 01.09.10 and not in format 01.09.2010, dates get moved somehow. That way I got dates after 28.09.10 moved to 1st, 2d and so on in October. Why don't you just make format setting like DD.MM.YY like text input?
iCash uses the system date format actually. Do you mean a format is missing?

I find problems #1 to #4 quite weird, either I am not understanding well or they are specific to the Russian version. However since iCash uses Unicode UTF-8 natively there shouldn't be any problem at all. Could you add here a screenshot of the import window after clicking on the preview button?
 

amtvsn

New Member
Do you mean the preview doesn't use the account you have selected?

Yes. Instead of using "Source account" it uses the "Default account" (Destination) for Source coulumn. And it's not only for preview, actual import does the same.

Not sure I understand what you mean. In iCash what most software call categories are folders. iCash uses accounts for everything. An account belongs to a category and each category belongs to a type.

Ok. I have Shopping @ iPhone, I want to import these transaction to Grocery @ iCash. How do I do that? May be this should be donw through rules, but as I can see, rules search only the comment field, which I normally don't have for cash transactions.

Incomes and Expenses are the names of types. Those names should never be used! In an importation you use account names not type names.

I'm trying to use these like TYPE names, not ACCOUNT names. I want to set the TYPE column. "Income" (in corresponding translation) value gets recognized correctly, "Expense" doesn't.

The Import from a bank statement is comment based, with no comments the function is useless and will never work.

You mean, that nevertheless I have categories in my external application, I have to write down comment for every transaction? Everything i need is change some hardcoded account names in CSV to accounts names I use in iCash.

iCash uses the system date format actually. Do you mean a format is missing?

No, I mean, that iCash gets confused if the year is in 2 digit format. Strange behaviuor.


Please see screenshot
 

stanbusk

Administrator
Staff member
You haven't entered any rule!!!!! This system with no rules is completely useless. I made this system to import transactions using the comments and user defined rules to select the transaction data depending on that comment. The best you could do here is to edit your file, set the debit and credit account for each transaction and use the other import, the text import. That import needs the minimum transaction data. Try to export some transactions and you will see what data is expected and in which order.
 

amtvsn

New Member
stanbusk said:
You haven't entered any rule!!!!! This system with no rules is completely useless. I made this system to import transactions using the comments and user defined rules to select the transaction data depending on that comment.

Can it search all other fields aswell? Not only comment?

stanbusk said:
The best you could do here is to edit your file, set the debit and credit account for each transaction and use the other import, the text import. That import needs the minimum transaction data. Try to export some transactions and you will see what data is expected and in which order.

Heh. With the same success I can enter all transactions manually by looking at my iPhone's screen.

You see, I have a pretty much real world use case. This was always a problem with cash, you don't know where it goes. You have only 2 options:

1. Save the check/bill
2. Save it immidiatly, write it down, rememeber, whatever

First doesn't work verywell, sometimes I cant remember what I was buying by some wierd legal person name which is different with the brand. This is very common for small shops and kiosks.

Keep everything in mind is impossible (for me). So I save everything to my iPhone. I like MoneyBook.app. The only way to keep it comfortable to use the phone for saving payment data is to keep amount of time, you spend on entering the transaction data not more then you spend on putting you wallet into your pocket.

You have to make it very fast. Few seconds: take out the phone, start app, new transaction, 5 eur, "Food", Save. Done!

If you add there several steps more: Description (tap!), F, o, o, d, Done. You've made 6 more taps, just the same 6 actions, you made to save the whole transaction! Double time! And what if I have German version?

Food = Lebensmittel / Mittagessen
Shopping = Lebensmittelladen
Car = Kraftfahrzeug
Pets = Haustiere
Gifts = Geschenke
and so on.

24 letters in English -> 60 in German
Almost 3 times as long.

If you need more time, because you need to type everything, you can chose with a tap of a finger (category name e.g.) in comment field, you'll probably say "I'll do that later, when I have time, and now I have to get in the car and drive, because..." And you will forget that.

The idea is — tere will be no comments in mobile app. No one will type them, if there is a way to avoid this.


I belive that your import system can be usefull if you have enough data. But what if you have less information? You have only destination, date and amount. Like you said it's useless. Not a good marketing motto, right?


---

So what I would suggest?

1. Fix the bugs. I tried Windows version in German and MacOS in Russian, bugs are pretty much reproductable.

2. Add rules for other fields, not only comment field.

---

This could solve the problem with the lack of iCash version for iPhone. I'd be happy to use iCash in connection with MoneyBook for iPhone. I like them both, but the problem is, they don't play together.
 

stanbusk

Administrator
Staff member
The import function you are using was introduced with iCash v6 in order to import data from bank statements, reason why it is called 'Import from a bank statement'. Bank statements do have a comment field. This function uses that comment field to import the transaction using a user-defined set of rules. Previous to iCash v6 the only import function was the import from text. You ask me to use something else that the comment field. What field do you want to use? Bear in mind that that system is supposed to be used with rules. What you see are not bugs, they are the result of using a function for something else that what it was designed for, that is, importing bank statements.
 

amtvsn

New Member
But this is an easy way to provide the synchronisation feature for mobile devices, isn't it? Or at least its temporary replacement until we have some better solution for that.

What do you think of that?
 

amtvsn

New Member
And I just cheked. The functionality, import is designed for, also doesn't work for me. Bank statement of my bank includes a lot of useless information, but useful fields are there too: date, reciever of the payment and amount. This is a bank statement of my credit card. It shows when, how much and in what shop have I payed.

1. I set up fields date, reciever, amount and disable all the rest.
2. I set bank account to "Credit Card"
3. "To account by default" I set "Other expenses"
4. Click "Preview"

I get a list of transaction which are going to be imported.

Why did my "Credit Card" go to the destination account column? It should be in the source. I spend money to AMAZON, not recieve them from it.

Expample line (transaction) in CSV:
1.10.2010; AMAZON SERVICE AG; 15.95;

How do I import it in iCash like this:
Source: Credit Card
Destination: Household / Other expenses
Amount: 15.95
Date: 1.10.2010
Comment: AMAZON SERVICE
Reciever: AMAZON
 

stanbusk

Administrator
Staff member
This function is to import Bank Statements ONLY! It is not to import misc. text, to sync with a mobil phone, etc... It is only to import Bank Statements. Any use of this function for things that are not importing Bank Statements are not supported. The function uses rules to import Bank Statements using the comment field. If you are indeed importing a Bank Statement and it doesn't work for you please send me a screenshot. I use the function myself almost every day and I have no problems with it. Since I released iCash v6 I have worked with lots of customers to enhance this function. If you have found a bug I will need enough info to reproduce it here.
 

amtvsn

New Member
I am trying to import my bank statement.

Could you please read the previous message - there is everything in it describing why it doesn't work for me.
 

stanbusk

Administrator
Staff member
Yes but now I need to reproduce here so I can see what problem it is. I recommend you to open a support ticket.
 
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